Discussion:
File Share
(too old to reply)
Joe Pardi
2005-10-13 00:44:10 UTC
Permalink
Looking for some Tandem help as I am not familiar with the platform ...

My company has a file transfer application on Tandem that receives files
and stores them on the system. Basically you could think of it as a
custom written FTP server.

What I'd like to do is to be able to process the file using a Java based
application that we've already written. Two options being tossed around
are to try and get the Java based application running on the Tandem
platform, or maybe set up some sort of file share between the Tandem and
Solaris, which is the operating system the Java application was
originally written for.

Since this will be a mission critical Production system, I was looking
more towards the file sharing option as I'm not sure how stable Java
technologies are on the Tandem platform.

My basic question is - what kind of file sharing mechanisms /
technologies exist between Tandem and Solaris, if any? Or can anyone
see any other viable options ...

P.S. This system will be used for a major credit card company to
process clearing and settlement files.

- Joe
mustlearntandem
2005-10-13 13:16:54 UTC
Permalink
Hi Joe -

Well it it's a "mission critical" application I would run it on the
Tandem before running it on the Sun box! But that aside you have a
number of options - not necessarily all pretty.

A couple of questions:

1) Are you currently running OSS on the Tandem? Is Java installed?

2) Is the file still needed on the Tandem? If it is could you just
modify the application to copy it (ftp or whatever) to the Sun?

My take is that If this is a critical file having two copies is never a
good idea.

If you go to the NonStop Technical Library and search on NFS you will
find information about sharing but I'm not sure you can share a file in
the Guardian space using NFS. Here's the NTL link:

http://h30163.www3.hp.com/NTL/

Also, here is a link to Java APIs for accessing Enscribe files - look
for JToolkit and particularly the JEnscribe API:

http://h20223.www2.hp.com/NonStopComputing/cache/79931-0-0-225-121.aspx
Joe Pardi
2005-10-13 16:08:45 UTC
Permalink
Answers inline ... joe
Post by mustlearntandem
Hi Joe -
Well it it's a "mission critical" application I would run it on the
Tandem before running it on the Sun box! But that aside you have a
number of options - not necessarily all pretty.
1) Are you currently running OSS on the Tandem? Is Java installed?
I think we're running Non-stop Himalayan (?), but I need to verify and
also get the exact footprint.
Post by mustlearntandem
2) Is the file still needed on the Tandem? If it is could you just
modify the application to copy it (ftp or whatever) to the Sun?
My take is that If this is a critical file having two copies is never a
good idea.
The file is not needed on the Tandem since it's just acting as a gateway
/ staging server to pass it to its target platform / application. I
would prefer to avoid a second file copy since it creates one more
"handshake".
Post by mustlearntandem
If you go to the NonStop Technical Library and search on NFS you will
find information about sharing but I'm not sure you can share a file in
http://h30163.www3.hp.com/NTL/
I will read up on this. Are there any other file sharing technologies
besides NFS that you can think of?
Post by mustlearntandem
Also, here is a link to Java APIs for accessing Enscribe files - look
http://h20223.www2.hp.com/NonStopComputing/cache/79931-0-0-225-121.aspx
Randall S. Becker
2005-10-18 01:38:02 UTC
Permalink
You can also use SAMBA. However, if you're running in a Sun environment, why
ever would you have a problem with NFS. It's probably already on the Sun and
certainly a more reliable transport than FTP, since timestamps and eofs and
content are easily verified on the client machine.
Post by Joe Pardi
Answers inline ... joe
Post by mustlearntandem
Hi Joe -
Well it it's a "mission critical" application I would run it on the
Tandem before running it on the Sun box! But that aside you have a
number of options - not necessarily all pretty.
1) Are you currently running OSS on the Tandem? Is Java installed?
I think we're running Non-stop Himalayan (?), but I need to verify and
also get the exact footprint.
Post by mustlearntandem
2) Is the file still needed on the Tandem? If it is could you just
modify the application to copy it (ftp or whatever) to the Sun?
My take is that If this is a critical file having two copies is never a
good idea.
The file is not needed on the Tandem since it's just acting as a gateway /
staging server to pass it to its target platform / application. I would
prefer to avoid a second file copy since it creates one more "handshake".
Post by mustlearntandem
If you go to the NonStop Technical Library and search on NFS you will
find information about sharing but I'm not sure you can share a file in
http://h30163.www3.hp.com/NTL/
I will read up on this. Are there any other file sharing technologies
besides NFS that you can think of?
Post by mustlearntandem
Also, here is a link to Java APIs for accessing Enscribe files - look
http://h20223.www2.hp.com/NonStopComputing/cache/79931-0-0-225-121.aspx
Bill Honaker
2005-10-13 14:09:44 UTC
Permalink
Joe,

What information causes you to believe that Java on the NonStop system
isn't stable? A lot of shops I'm aware of use it for their mission
critical apps.

You do need to be aware of the current release levels to make the best
configuration options... you should get help from the local HP office
verifying this if its an option (even a paid one). Java ports to
NonStop are trivial... unless vendor-specific JNI implementations are
required; even those are not difficult.

Bill Honaker
XID, Ltd.
Post by Joe Pardi
Looking for some Tandem help as I am not familiar with the platform ...
My company has a file transfer application on Tandem that receives files
and stores them on the system. Basically you could think of it as a
custom written FTP server.
What I'd like to do is to be able to process the file using a Java based
application that we've already written. Two options being tossed around
are to try and get the Java based application running on the Tandem
platform, or maybe set up some sort of file share between the Tandem and
Solaris, which is the operating system the Java application was
originally written for.
Since this will be a mission critical Production system, I was looking
more towards the file sharing option as I'm not sure how stable Java
technologies are on the Tandem platform.
My basic question is - what kind of file sharing mechanisms /
technologies exist between Tandem and Solaris, if any? Or can anyone
see any other viable options ...
P.S. This system will be used for a major credit card company to
process clearing and settlement files.
- Joe
Joe Pardi
2005-10-13 16:04:10 UTC
Permalink
We don't really have any emperical evidence that supports my claim
regarding stability, it's more of a suspicion based on the newness of
Java on the Tandem. Like any new technology, if experienced folks
indicate that they are having good experiences in writing Java
applications for the Tandem platform, that would be rather encouraging.
If we decide to port this app to Tandem, we will fund a proof of concept
anyway, because it's so mission-critical. It also cannot suffer too
much of a performance hit. If it is 20-30% slower, that might be okay,
but anything more than that would be a concern.

I trivialized the application a bit and called a Java app. It actually
is in the sense that it doesn't run in an application server, but uses
alot of open source libraries such as Jetty, OpenSSL, OpenLDAP, etc.
Their ability to port to Tandem is a concern also, but I suspect we'll
be able to gte through that since we have the source. Good news is that
there is very little (if any) JNI.

I'm not the expert with our current Tandem footprint, but I will hunt
some more information down and share.

- Joe
Post by Bill Honaker
Joe,
What information causes you to believe that Java on the NonStop system
isn't stable? A lot of shops I'm aware of use it for their mission
critical apps.
You do need to be aware of the current release levels to make the best
configuration options... you should get help from the local HP office
verifying this if its an option (even a paid one). Java ports to
NonStop are trivial... unless vendor-specific JNI implementations are
required; even those are not difficult.
Bill Honaker
XID, Ltd.
Post by Joe Pardi
Looking for some Tandem help as I am not familiar with the platform ...
My company has a file transfer application on Tandem that receives files
and stores them on the system. Basically you could think of it as a
custom written FTP server.
What I'd like to do is to be able to process the file using a Java based
application that we've already written. Two options being tossed around
are to try and get the Java based application running on the Tandem
platform, or maybe set up some sort of file share between the Tandem and
Solaris, which is the operating system the Java application was
originally written for.
Since this will be a mission critical Production system, I was looking
more towards the file sharing option as I'm not sure how stable Java
technologies are on the Tandem platform.
My basic question is - what kind of file sharing mechanisms /
technologies exist between Tandem and Solaris, if any? Or can anyone
see any other viable options ...
P.S. This system will be used for a major credit card company to
process clearing and settlement files.
- Joe
mustlearntandem
2005-10-13 18:29:50 UTC
Permalink
You mentioned that the Tandem app is a home-grown FTP - does it conform
to the FTP spec or does it just "act" like ftp? If so why not just ftp
it directly to the Sun box? Or is it a third-part message switch
application?
Bill Honaker
2005-10-14 00:46:51 UTC
Permalink
The JVM on the NonStop is in its third genetion (based on Sun's 1.4).
It has been running on the system for many years. Just as with any
JVM, heap tuning, HotSpot, JIT configurations impact the app; your
20-30% number; slower than what? Slower than the Sun? If so what
speed processor? My understanding of JVM performance is that using
Java gives one a 20-30% 'performance impact' over using compiled
languages like C/C++.

I know of a number of ports of GNU and other open source, but am not
aware of much that has been included in the JVM. OpenSSL is available
from the ITUGLIB Library at www.itug.org; OpenLDAP is available, I
believe, from Bowden systems at www.bsi2.com. Search both those for a
sizable list of Open Source. I know that Bowden also provides support
for some packages if that's needed. If you or someone from your
company plans to attend the ITUG conference week after next in San
Jose, there are 2 SIGS of interest to you; Open Source and Java.
Depending on what you use your NonStops for, that conference is the
best investment available to educate owners of NonStops on effective
use thereof.

Bill
Post by Joe Pardi
We don't really have any emperical evidence that supports my claim
regarding stability, it's more of a suspicion based on the newness of
Java on the Tandem. Like any new technology, if experienced folks
indicate that they are having good experiences in writing Java
applications for the Tandem platform, that would be rather encouraging.
If we decide to port this app to Tandem, we will fund a proof of concept
anyway, because it's so mission-critical. It also cannot suffer too
much of a performance hit. If it is 20-30% slower, that might be okay,
but anything more than that would be a concern.
I trivialized the application a bit and called a Java app. It actually
is in the sense that it doesn't run in an application server, but uses
alot of open source libraries such as Jetty, OpenSSL, OpenLDAP, etc.
Their ability to port to Tandem is a concern also, but I suspect we'll
be able to gte through that since we have the source. Good news is that
there is very little (if any) JNI.
I'm not the expert with our current Tandem footprint, but I will hunt
some more information down and share.
- Joe
Post by Bill Honaker
Joe,
What information causes you to believe that Java on the NonStop system
isn't stable? A lot of shops I'm aware of use it for their mission
critical apps.
You do need to be aware of the current release levels to make the best
configuration options... you should get help from the local HP office
verifying this if its an option (even a paid one). Java ports to
NonStop are trivial... unless vendor-specific JNI implementations are
required; even those are not difficult.
Bill Honaker
XID, Ltd.
Post by Joe Pardi
Looking for some Tandem help as I am not familiar with the platform ...
My company has a file transfer application on Tandem that receives files
and stores them on the system. Basically you could think of it as a
custom written FTP server.
What I'd like to do is to be able to process the file using a Java based
application that we've already written. Two options being tossed around
are to try and get the Java based application running on the Tandem
platform, or maybe set up some sort of file share between the Tandem and
Solaris, which is the operating system the Java application was
originally written for.
Since this will be a mission critical Production system, I was looking
more towards the file sharing option as I'm not sure how stable Java
technologies are on the Tandem platform.
My basic question is - what kind of file sharing mechanisms /
technologies exist between Tandem and Solaris, if any? Or can anyone
see any other viable options ...
P.S. This system will be used for a major credit card company to
process clearing and settlement files.
- Joe
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